615 ответов в теме

[TechNine]

Самое плохое в этой системе то, что воевать за луну в Курсе, например, смысла не будет, ибо собрать там ничего не удастся. То есть теряется ещё один ПвП аспект

Не вижу в этом ничего плохого. Луны Курсы -- для жителей Курсы!

[Illiet]

Не вижу в этом ничего плохого. Луны Курсы -- для жителей Курсы!

Жду луны!

[Kawa]

А чем она определяется? Цена в каких-то рамках плавает, нижний предел определяется в том числе и себестоимостью (себестоимость миников для владельца рорки будет меньше например себестоимости того же объема честным образом вскопанного халком).

Я ровно то же самое написал: себестоимость - это просто нижний порог, за которым нет смысла в производстве. И да, у кого-то она ниже. Соответственно на насыщенном рынке остаются именно те, у кого она ниже, остальные уходят по мере снижения цены. Но сама цена определяется не себестоимостью.
 

Мне еще интересно как это вне локальных микрорынков (а дельв №3 маркет в игре) ты будешь что-то продавать без периодического передергивания ордеров? как закупать будешь материалы? эта пижня позволяет тебе быстрее оборачивать иски, т.к. профит у тебя идет с каждого оборота - больше циклов - больше профита. Первым чаром на триале он заморачивался. 

Так, как сейчас продаю в Жите. Смотрю на историю цен, прикидываю "правильную" цену, выставляю ордер. Как правило уходит в течении нескольких дней. "Быстрее оборачивать" - это для тех, у кого узкое место в оборотке. У меня сейчас узкое место в производстве. И раньше, до перерыва, узкое место было в производстве. Какой смысл торчать в маркете и пытаться ускорить продажу, если все линии загружены на несколько суток вперед?

[RLeonis]

зависит от товара, что-то высоколиквидно, что-то нет.

 

 

Главная мысль, которую человек пытается донести до других, заключается в том, что он имеет доступ к гораздо более престижному потреблению, чем про него могли подумать. Одновременно с этим он старается объяснить окружающим, что их тип потребления гораздо менее престижен, чем они имели наивность думать. 

 

 

Сообщение отредактировал RLeonis: 23 July 2017 - 9:42

[Kawa]

зависит от товара, что-то высоколиквидное, что-то нет.

Ну да. Но мне как правило проще добавить оборотки, чем тратить время на торчание в маркете. Тем более, что при нынешней цене плекса заводить чисто производственных альтов смысла вообще нет, так что узким местом останутся линии, а не оборотка.

[RLeonis]

ну так, а я что утверждал что нужно торчать в маркете? наоборот таких позиций лучше избегать. но ордера дергать все равно приходится.

[Kawa]

ну так, а я что утверждал что нужно торчать в маркете? наоборот таких позиций лучше избегать. но ордера дергать все равно приходится.

Ну вот я их почти не дергаю. Переставляю иногда, обычно когда в очередной раз в хаб тащу что-то, но это не 0.01иск-пвп. Вон месяца три назад с некоторой планетаркой в жите картина была - в выходные рынок резко заваливают и роняют цену, к следующим выходным уже подрастает обратно. Достаточно было грубо говоря поставить "цену четверга" и забыть, к выходным заберут уже. Сейчас там куча спекулей на пандовских цитах, уже цена ровной стала, да и рынок колбасит временами, так что промахи часто. Но в принципе все равно продается без особого шаманства с ордерами.

[Etherlord]

так там все ещё идёт срач про 200 бш в 500 крузаков и в 1000 рифтеров превратятся?)

 

там, кстати никто у товарища не уточнил - пилоты клонироваться будут, али как?) или суровые мачалководы распетярятся и будут летать на рифторах?)

[Kawa]

так там все ещё идёт срач про 200 бш в 500 крузаков и в 1000 рифтеров превратятся?)

 

там, кстати никто у товарища не уточнил - пилоты клонироваться будут, али как?) или суровые мачалководы распетярятся и будут летать на рифторах?)

Так у него же все сразу запедонапятся. Сейчас вот им что-то мешает запедонапиться, чтобы вместо 200 фероксов 1000 была. А как только на рифтеры пересядут - так сразу.

[RLeonis]

да все просто, альянсы которые позиционируют себя как "newbie friendly" имеют необходимость давать контент для всех,  на моа и какракалах и прочих т1 гаджетах. а лето не только пора отпусков, но и каникулы.

[Etherlord]

Ох как у кого то подпекло)

 

вообще мне кажется что будет как с этнозисами. Штука позволяющая хоть немножечко тыкать палочкой в местных аборигенов

ну и как всегда в следующие 2 месяца будут крутить все возможные рульки "балансера" - ибо подумать и потестить они не смогли XD

 

да все просто, альянсы которые позиционируют себя как "newbie friendly" имеют необходимость давать контент для всех,  на моа и какракалах и прочих т1 гаджетах. а лето не только пора отпусков, но и каникулы.

только причем здесь нубофрендли и 200 пилотов мачалок, даунгрейднувшихся до ферроксов и распятерившихся до рифтеров

 

этим альянсам что ли сейчас кто то запрещает это делать?) слишком дешево ? XD

Сообщение отредактировал Etherlord: 23 July 2017 - 19:25

[RLeonis]

ну так они и делают. просто это не даунгрейд. 

[Etherlord]

ну так они и делают. просто это не даунгрейд. 

мой вопрос то был в другом, ну

как 200 текущих пилотов, которым "дороха" стало, резко стали 1000

 

т.е. говорить про занапиться, голубовагониться и прочее - это одно, а то, что им стало дорого и из 200 они пересели на 500, а потом на 1000 меня это просто таки повеселило, то, что намберсы просто так увеличились в 5 раз Просто вот те 200 ферроксов как были 200, так и останутся 200, хоть и рифтеров, а что к ним там прибьётся это совсем другая история.

[Tommy TQ]

Всякое разное от Фоззи на EVE Northeast! /с Wingspantt

C7 может запилят в будущем )

первые 11 ответов как раз про мунмайнинг

Спойлер

Hey everyone, I just got back from EVE Northeast! It was a lot of fun and awesome to meet so many people (especially wormhole people) in person.

CCP Fozzie was in attendance, and in addition to kicking everyone's asses in both poker and IRL PVP, he held a dev Q&A today. I didn't record the Q&A, but going off my notes and my slightly sober memory, here's what was covered. Some of this may not be 100% new, plus a lot of it was disclaimed with "I'm not an expert on everything/responsible for everything/able to talk about everything."

I'll try to break things into similar topics so it's easier to understand. Again, this is MOSTLY from memory so if I get a detail wrong, I blame alcohol + Fozzie for headshotting me in the PVP jousting match. If anyone in attendance remembers something I missed, feel free to add it!

• Someone asked about transition period between moon mining and Refinery fracking. Fozzie said there would be NO transition period. The day refineries launch, all moon mining POSes will no longer function.
• This will, in addition with the randomization of moon composition, create a mad dash to plan, survey, and claim moons in those first few days.
• Someone asked who can see the fracking timer. Fozzie said that when a player initiaties the tractor beam to pull up rocks, they can choose to add the timer to the corp calendar. He said otherwise it would be visible to anyone with structure command roles in corp. He said they might finesse that, and also a reminder that everyone can tell "approximately" how long it will take based on in-game visuals of the tractor beam.
• Fozzie notes it would be "several days, at least one day" from a tractor completion to natural asteroid degradation, if nobody shows up to mine the asteroids first.
• Someone asked what happens when the asteroids die. Fozzie said probably they'll just disappear, but if they are able to he'd prefer that NPC mining ships show up and finish it off.
• Fozzie noted that after Refineries launch, all moons will no longer rotate, for graphics reasons.
• Fozzie said when refineries launch, all refinery-related rigs will get unfit from other structures, so owners could decide to refit them or put them on the higher-bonused Refineries
• I asked how far the asteroid field would spawn from Refineries once fracked. Fozzie said "about 100km" putting the mining ships just outside of both tethering range and the warp-to-citadel range.
• The combat power of Refineries will be around that of Engineering Complexes. Specifically, he said the goal was that the Medium refinery is weaker than a Medium EC, but a Large refinery is stronger than a Large EC.
• Someone asked about Small refineries, and he said they would get to Small structures later.

• Fozzie reacted positively to people suggesting that moons could be periodically reset on a recurring basis so moons don't get "solved" again.

• Void bombs are getting nerfed "very soon"

• Someone asked if CCP was considering reducing the number or difficulty of timers for Citadel bashes. He said they are looking at it right now and will be making changes soon. He did not like the idea of requiring fuel for them.

• I asked if Advertising Structures were still being worked on. Fozzie said yes, they were still in the plans and would most likely resemble existing billboards/holograms.

• Someone asked about alliance/corp logos on ships, Fozzie said they want to do it but are hitting lots of roadblocks about finding appropriate space on every hull where logos would be visible no matter their design or color. Someone asked if some kind of flag/banner hologram like on citadels would work, and he said it's possible that could be a good solution.

• I asked if Citadel SKINS were coming, Fozzie said CCP wants to make them but has to rework a separate SKIN system because the existing one is tied to player accounts.

• Someone asked why Titan effect generators don't require w-space mats, even though in the lore they're built on wormhole technology. Fozzie had a comical shrug for an answer.

• Fozzie explained effect generators were hugely unpopular. They were an attempt to appeal to combo-style players (see: Johnny gamer archetype from Magic the Gathering design) but apparently not enough Titan pilots are "Johnny" types.

• Someone asked about capital sized, and Fozzie said art would be working on increasing the size of all non-FAX, non-Titan capitals.

• Someone asked about upcoming pirate capitals, and I asked if Sisters of EVE would get a capital. Fozzie said if they did, it would be a FAX

• Someone asked if he thought FAXes were overpowered in wormhole space, and he said they were trying to come up with a way to address FAX power. He said one idea was making bombs that lowered repair rate, but they were still working on it.

• Someone asked if CCP is happy with the state of capital clone bays. Fozzie said not really, and ideally they would rework the whole system to be more interesting and intuitive.

• Someone asked "when can I fly my Titan in Jita?" and Fozzie said they had discussed allowing capitals in hisec, but with the caveat they were always suspect flagged.

• Someone asked about battleship cargo space. Fozzie says they want to increase it, but that if they overbuff it, it would be bad, because shrinking cargo holds "can do very bad things" to pilots with ships in space. He said they'd like to make tiny incremental increases as they rebalance.

• Someone asked when cloaky camping would get nerfed. Fozzie said that cloaking as a whole would not get nerfed unless local as a whole also got reworked. He said the systems are too intertwined to touch one without the other.

• Someone asked if the Munninn could get a 4th mid, and he said yes, it can, and that would be a reasonable change when they rebalance it.

• Someone asked if anyone uses polarized launchers. Fozzie answered a few have niche uses, but they are being used. He said polarized torpedo launchers are the most popular.

• Someone asked if CCP would let players know if Project Discovery found a real planet. He said CCP would make a big deal out of it, because it would be a huge marketing opportunity and gaming journalists would eat it up

• All questions regarding Project Nova were met with tight-lipped "it's coming along" responses

• Someone asked Fozzie if he's happy with locator agents. He said no, and is open to suggestions. Someone suggested making locator services require LP, and he really liked that idea.

• Someone asked if Fozzie thought T3Cs were balanced now or needed more tweaks. He said he was on vacation since the changes, and assumes that since nobody called or emailed him telling him the game was ruined, it was too early to know.

• Someone asked if SP loss would ever be removed from T3Cs. Fozzie said the fact that T3Cs have remained popular (including now) even with SP loss shows that it isn't hindering people from having fun.

• Fozzie said if 90% of EVE stopped using T3Cs, CCP would remove SP loss. He also noted that the vast majority of players just train back the SP loss, not inject it

• Fozzie talked about the idea of making special edition ships or objects in the future decaying. For instance, you get the ship and it has a 10 day timer. After 10 days, it disappears. He also talked about making items that do the same, so that if you don't build something with it in X days, you lose the opportunity to do so. This would be a solution to people hoarding limited quantity objects/ships

• I asked if special edition/limited ships could be added to a "Special Ships" tab of the Ship Tree and Fozzie said yes, it's a good idea as soon as they figure out how to organize them within that tab

• Someone asked when the Drifter storyline would be completed, and he said they were leaving the door open to be picked up at the appropriate time

• Someone asked if there would ever be C7 or higher wormhole space. He said it's very likely something like that is done in the future. He also said that one way to make higher class space more dangerous is to make it actively hostile. For instance, opening a C7 connection connects you to "1,000 drifters" who start invading your system.

• Fozzie's favorite ship is the Sleipnir.

EDIT: Thanks for the insults and downvotes everyone. Remind me never to waste two hours of my life doing something like this again.

 

[uaindustri]

Всякое разное от Фоззи на EVE Northeast! /с Wingspantt

C7 может запилят в будущем )

первые 11 ответов как раз про мунмайнинг

Спойлер

Hey everyone, I just got back from EVE Northeast! It was a lot of fun and awesome to meet so many people (especially wormhole people) in person.

CCP Fozzie was in attendance, and in addition to kicking everyone's asses in both poker and IRL PVP, he held a dev Q&A today. I didn't record the Q&A, but going off my notes and my slightly sober memory, here's what was covered. Some of this may not be 100% new, plus a lot of it was disclaimed with "I'm not an expert on everything/responsible for everything/able to talk about everything."

I'll try to break things into similar topics so it's easier to understand. Again, this is MOSTLY from memory so if I get a detail wrong, I blame alcohol + Fozzie for headshotting me in the PVP jousting match. If anyone in attendance remembers something I missed, feel free to add it!

• Someone asked about transition period between moon mining and Refinery fracking. Fozzie said there would be NO transition period. The day refineries launch, all moon mining POSes will no longer function.
• 
  
• This will, in addition with the randomization of moon composition, create a mad dash to plan, survey, and claim moons in those first few days.
• 
  
• Someone asked who can see the fracking timer. Fozzie said that when a player initiaties the tractor beam to pull up rocks, they can choose to add the timer to the corp calendar. He said otherwise it would be visible to anyone with structure command roles in corp. He said they might finesse that, and also a reminder that everyone can tell "approximately" how long it will take based on in-game visuals of the tractor beam.
• 
  
• Fozzie notes it would be "several days, at least one day" from a tractor completion to natural asteroid degradation, if nobody shows up to mine the asteroids first.
• 
  
• Someone asked what happens when the asteroids die. Fozzie said probably they'll just disappear, but if they are able to he'd prefer that NPC mining ships show up and finish it off.
• 
  
• Fozzie noted that after Refineries launch, all moons will no longer rotate, for graphics reasons.
• 
  
• Fozzie said when refineries launch, all refinery-related rigs will get unfit from other structures, so owners could decide to refit them or put them on the higher-bonused Refineries
• 
  
• I asked how far the asteroid field would spawn from Refineries once fracked. Fozzie said "about 100km" putting the mining ships just outside of both tethering range and the warp-to-citadel range.
• 
  
• The combat power of Refineries will be around that of Engineering Complexes. Specifically, he said the goal was that the Medium refinery is weaker than a Medium EC, but a Large refinery is stronger than a Large EC.
• 
  
• Someone asked about Small refineries, and he said they would get to Small structures later.
• 
  
• 
  

  Fozzie reacted positively to people suggesting that moons could be periodically reset on a recurring basis so moons don't get "solved" again.

• 
  
• 
  

  Void bombs are getting nerfed "very soon"

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked if CCP was considering reducing the number or difficulty of timers for Citadel bashes. He said they are looking at it right now and will be making changes soon. He did not like the idea of requiring fuel for them.

• 
  
• 
  

  I asked if Advertising Structures were still being worked on. Fozzie said yes, they were still in the plans and would most likely resemble existing billboards/holograms.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked about alliance/corp logos on ships, Fozzie said they want to do it but are hitting lots of roadblocks about finding appropriate space on every hull where logos would be visible no matter their design or color. Someone asked if some kind of flag/banner hologram like on citadels would work, and he said it's possible that could be a good solution.

• 
  
• 
  

  I asked if Citadel SKINS were coming, Fozzie said CCP wants to make them but has to rework a separate SKIN system because the existing one is tied to player accounts.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked why Titan effect generators don't require w-space mats, even though in the lore they're built on wormhole technology. Fozzie had a comical shrug for an answer.

• 
  
• 
  

  Fozzie explained effect generators were hugely unpopular. They were an attempt to appeal to combo-style players (see: Johnny gamer archetype from Magic the Gathering design) but apparently not enough Titan pilots are "Johnny" types.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked about capital sized, and Fozzie said art would be working on increasing the size of all non-FAX, non-Titan capitals.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked about upcoming pirate capitals, and I asked if Sisters of EVE would get a capital. Fozzie said if they did, it would be a FAX

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked if he thought FAXes were overpowered in wormhole space, and he said they were trying to come up with a way to address FAX power. He said one idea was making bombs that lowered repair rate, but they were still working on it.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked if CCP is happy with the state of capital clone bays. Fozzie said not really, and ideally they would rework the whole system to be more interesting and intuitive.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked "when can I fly my Titan in Jita?" and Fozzie said they had discussed allowing capitals in hisec, but with the caveat they were always suspect flagged.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked about battleship cargo space. Fozzie says they want to increase it, but that if they overbuff it, it would be bad, because shrinking cargo holds "can do very bad things" to pilots with ships in space. He said they'd like to make tiny incremental increases as they rebalance.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked when cloaky camping would get nerfed. Fozzie said that cloaking as a whole would not get nerfed unless local as a whole also got reworked. He said the systems are too intertwined to touch one without the other.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked if the Munninn could get a 4th mid, and he said yes, it can, and that would be a reasonable change when they rebalance it.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked if anyone uses polarized launchers. Fozzie answered a few have niche uses, but they are being used. He said polarized torpedo launchers are the most popular.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked if CCP would let players know if Project Discovery found a real planet. He said CCP would make a big deal out of it, because it would be a huge marketing opportunity and gaming journalists would eat it up

• 
  
• 
  

  All questions regarding Project Nova were met with tight-lipped "it's coming along" responses

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked Fozzie if he's happy with locator agents. He said no, and is open to suggestions. Someone suggested making locator services require LP, and he really liked that idea.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked if Fozzie thought T3Cs were balanced now or needed more tweaks. He said he was on vacation since the changes, and assumes that since nobody called or emailed him telling him the game was ruined, it was too early to know.

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked if SP loss would ever be removed from T3Cs. Fozzie said the fact that T3Cs have remained popular (including now) even with SP loss shows that it isn't hindering people from having fun.

• 
  
• 
  

  Fozzie said if 90% of EVE stopped using T3Cs, CCP would remove SP loss. He also noted that the vast majority of players just train back the SP loss, not inject it

• 
  
• 
  

  Fozzie talked about the idea of making special edition ships or objects in the future decaying. For instance, you get the ship and it has a 10 day timer. After 10 days, it disappears. He also talked about making items that do the same, so that if you don't build something with it in X days, you lose the opportunity to do so. This would be a solution to people hoarding limited quantity objects/ships

• 
  
• 
  

  I asked if special edition/limited ships could be added to a "Special Ships" tab of the Ship Tree and Fozzie said yes, it's a good idea as soon as they figure out how to organize them within that tab

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked when the Drifter storyline would be completed, and he said they were leaving the door open to be picked up at the appropriate time

• 
  
• 
  

  Someone asked if there would ever be C7 or higher wormhole space. He said it's very likely something like that is done in the future. He also said that one way to make higher class space more dangerous is to make it actively hostile. For instance, opening a C7 connection connects you to "1,000 drifters" who start invading your system.

• 
  
• 
  

  Fozzie's favorite ship is the Sleipnir.

• 
  

EDIT: Thanks for the insults and downvotes everyone. Remind me never to waste two hours of my life doing something like this again.

давайте закроем этот сайт раз ты так желаешь завалить его текстом на английском?

[makstomaks]

А в чем проблема текста на английском для обсуждения? Минорчик пролетает мимо?
Там все довольно простыми фразами написано, если ты понимаешь что такое праймари/апроч, то и простынку поймёшь.

[uaindustri]

у меня даже нет проблем зайти в мамблу и напрячь людей попереводить мне...я даже так иногда делаю НО

если ресурс русскоязычный то будьте добры или крестик снимите или трусы наденьте...

обсуждать репост на английском сидя на ивру это копрофилия коей я не страдаю...хочу английского иду там где его готовят и это явно не  этот сайт

Сообщение отредактировал uaindustri: 24 July 2017 - 0:46

[makstomaks]

Иди, вряд ли кто то расстроится.
А мы пообсуждаем, что ццп додумалось костыльным методом до иссякания ресурсов и быть может, если они это введут, новая система окажется не так уж и плоха.

[Yodik]

лиза переводи.

[uaindustri]

Иди, вряд ли кто то расстроится.
А мы пообсуждаем, что ццп додумалось костыльным методом до иссякания ресурсов и быть может, если они это введут, новая система окажется не так уж и плоха.

да мы уже всё обсудили это в канальчике производственников гунляндии...

там даже много скринов мелькает порой с сиси сервака, но мне думается делится этой инфой и выводами идея плохая и пахнет предательством потому воздержусь...

буду наблюдать